Gun Laws
American Live Wire: The Dick Act is Not the Gun-Control Holy Grail
http://americanlivewire.com/the-dick-act-gun-control/
The Volokh Conspiracy - The Dick Act and Gun Control - http://www.volokh.com/2013/01/25/the-dick-act-and-gun-control/
___Thumbcruncher: Sorry to tell you this Mr. Kopel, but you are wrong on the 1792 militia Act. It was not amended in 1795, it was first amended in 1803. A total of four amendments are in Statutes at large, all of course in-active since the 1792 militia Act was repealed in 1903 with the Dick Act. Now I can understand you not knowing this since I only stumbled on them by accident (they are not properly listed with the 1792 act). I also can understand that you might not know there is a 1815 military draft law in Statutes-At-Large that is the first military draft from militia (a draft were the men are asked to bring their own gun). I can also understand you not knowing that the National Guard begins its existence in 1812, not after the Civil War: The War in fact began with early NG units battling it out at the first battle of Bull Run. The point is where this Email is a hoax, it would help if you were more accurate yourself. - When it comes to the Dick Act we have to note the 1916 national Defense Act. In that Act men from the unorganized militia (as defined by the 1903 Act) are the source of men for military service (section 79, repealed in 1920 after world War 1 ended). This repealed section is however invoked within the Selective Service Act by the reference to the policy and procedures set down in the 1916 National Defense Act. The 1916 act also created public shooting ranges that were then to be used to train conscripts during a national crisis (the beginning of the CMP program).
___ek ErilaR: I'm pretty sure that the term "National Guard" was not any kind of official designation until 1903. Before 1903, state controlled military formations were called militia. During the Civil War and Spanish-American War regiments raised by the states for federal service were usually called volunteers or volunteer militia. - Most agree that the militia traces its origins to Massachusetts in 1636 when the "trained bands" of the towns, similar to the "trained bands" that formed the core of the New Model Army in England after 1645, were organized into regiments by the Massachusetts Bay Colony. Thereafter, and until 1903, the state militias were expected to provide the majority of nation's armed forces in times of national emergency.
___Thumbcruncher: The only thing you had right was that prior to 1903 the State militias were to supply the majority of the men in a national emergency. The first time the term National Guard was used was by Lafayette when he visited the United States in 1824. The title was from Lafayette's own Garde Nationale De Paris, and was accepted by a New York State Regiment of volunteers. Over the years before the Civil War the number of such units expanded until in 1878 the National Guard Association was formed. It was the NGA that pushed for the passage of a new militia Act that made them the only official active militia in the country: the Dick Act of 1903. - As for the Spanish American War, the States didn't raise any troops for that conflict. Modern Revisionists say the State of New York gave Roosevelt the chance to serve. Reality says he resigned his State militia commission and then volunteered for service in the conflict. Whole NGA units resigned and then marched down to recruiting stations because their state wouldn't allow them to serve. Some states protested by creating new militia units that were to replace the former units when they returned. The US government ordered these units disbanded after the war and that the former volunteers be reinstated. One New York governor went so far as to kick an organization called the National Rifle Association out of the State as a protest against the Spanish American War. Thats why the Creedmore Cup rifle marksmenship events are held in Nw Jersey in stead of Creedmore Long Island
___ek ErilaR: Read the orders of battle for the engagements in the Span-Am War. You will find state militia regiments in everyone of them. Mass and NY did the same as they did in the Civil War; they raised volunteer regiments for federal service built around cadre drawn from the state militia. The 2nd, 6th and 9th Mass. Volunteer Infantry and regiments from New York, North Carolina Ohio, Pennsylvania and Michigan were in Cuba and Puerto Rico. - The nick name name "national guard" adopted by one New York regiment for a single event means nothing. As you note, the regiment was an element of the long existing New York State Militia. "NYSM" was stamped on their belt buckles. - Are seriously saying that there were "NGA" units in any state before 1903? The National Guard Association was a lobbying group. This is an obscure point but some states still have active State Guards that are not a part of the National Guard. You are a bit over your head if you do not think that the National Guard itself traces its origins to the Mass Bay Colony in 1636. You have not done the basic reading.
___Thumbcruncher: The problem isn't that I haven't done the basic reading, the problem is I have gone beyond it. Basic reading says the 1792 militia Act was never taken into effect and it has no requirements. The facts are it was amended four times (the last in 1822) and it has a caliber clause requiring the male population to own a specific caliber of arm. - You mentioned that some States still have Active State Guards. Basic reading says thats illegal: a more extensive look uncovers the State Defense Force Acts passed after the first World War. There is your Cadre Strength militia, kept at Cadre strength by federal law until War is declare. Then, because the Federal government will only supply enough arms to equip a force half the strength of the NG units in the State, most states operating SDF units will only operate a force half the size of there peace time NG unit. And as of last report from the National Guard Bureau there are 24 States with active SDF units. - Do you deny the existence of the National Guard Association in 1878. And of course by default you deny the groups they represented, for what is a lobbying group for but to lobby Congress for a specific group of people. So if the lobbying group formally formed in 1878, by default there must have been groups of militia that called themselves National Guard. - In a different response to Mr. Kopel's posting you suggested that the Massachusetts system went unchanged from 1636 to 1903. Yet you then are unaware that in 1840 Massachusetts removed its laws governing its common militia and went only to a volunteer system. Its was this change that spread through New England and ended enforcement of the 1792 militia Act by 1850. - Basic reading: simply looking at the National Guard Website or talking to the NG rep. I have a copy of the poster they hand out showing this 1636 militia with their pikemen. The difference is understanding that your minuteman system was started just before the revolution, not back in 1636. It also lasted only a year into the Revolution as people began to realize that Minutemen never fought alone (other then at lexington). The rest of the militia always had time to form up before the British arrived. Oh, and the Minutemen were not volunteers: otherwise how do you insure that the youngest, strongest and most firearm experienced men are in it. And Massachusetts didn't financially support the minutemen with clothing and arms, drill money didn't begin until after the Civil War.
DICK ACT of 1902 . . . CAN'T BE REPEALED (GUN CONTROL FORBIDDEN) The Trump Card Enacted by the Congress Further Asserting the Second Amendment as Untouchable http://www.fourwinds10.net/siterun_data/government/us_constitution/gun_control/news.php?q=1237163642
Militia Act of 1903 The Militia Act of 1903 (32 Stat. 775), also known as the Dick Act, was legislation which codified the circumstances under which the National Guard could be federalized. It also provided federal funds to the National Guard to pay for equipment and training, including annual summer encampments. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Militia_Act_of_1903
Snopes.com Dick Act
The Dick Act passed in 1903 "invalidates all gun control laws" in the U.S.
Read more at http://www.snopes.com/politics/guns/dickact.asp#8XCesBZFZvAb7Qi4.99
FALSE
http://www.snopes.com/politics/guns/dickact.asp
DICK ACT of 1902 . . . CAN'T BE REPEALED (GUN CONTROL FORBIDDEN) The Trump Card Enacted by the Congress Further Asserting the Second Amendment as Untouchable http://www.webenews.com/dick_act_of_1902.htm
The NRA’s Trump Card: The Dick Act of 1902 http://www.1800politics.com/the-nras-trump-card-the-dick-act-of-1902/
GUN CONTROL, THE DICK ACT OF 1902, BILLS OF ATTAINDER AND EX POST FACTO LAWS http://www.newswithviews.com/Publius/huldah114.htm
Dick Act mythmaking http://armsandthelaw.com/archives/2013/01/dick_act_mythma.php
The Dick Act of 1902! Not a Joke http://beforeitsnews.com/alternative/2013/03/the-dick-act-of-1902-not-a-joke-2581386.html
The Daily Sheeple The Dick Act of 1902 http://www.thedailysheeple.com/the-dick-act-of-1902_042013
http://americanlivewire.com/the-dick-act-gun-control/
The Volokh Conspiracy - The Dick Act and Gun Control - http://www.volokh.com/2013/01/25/the-dick-act-and-gun-control/
___Thumbcruncher: Sorry to tell you this Mr. Kopel, but you are wrong on the 1792 militia Act. It was not amended in 1795, it was first amended in 1803. A total of four amendments are in Statutes at large, all of course in-active since the 1792 militia Act was repealed in 1903 with the Dick Act. Now I can understand you not knowing this since I only stumbled on them by accident (they are not properly listed with the 1792 act). I also can understand that you might not know there is a 1815 military draft law in Statutes-At-Large that is the first military draft from militia (a draft were the men are asked to bring their own gun). I can also understand you not knowing that the National Guard begins its existence in 1812, not after the Civil War: The War in fact began with early NG units battling it out at the first battle of Bull Run. The point is where this Email is a hoax, it would help if you were more accurate yourself. - When it comes to the Dick Act we have to note the 1916 national Defense Act. In that Act men from the unorganized militia (as defined by the 1903 Act) are the source of men for military service (section 79, repealed in 1920 after world War 1 ended). This repealed section is however invoked within the Selective Service Act by the reference to the policy and procedures set down in the 1916 National Defense Act. The 1916 act also created public shooting ranges that were then to be used to train conscripts during a national crisis (the beginning of the CMP program).
___ek ErilaR: I'm pretty sure that the term "National Guard" was not any kind of official designation until 1903. Before 1903, state controlled military formations were called militia. During the Civil War and Spanish-American War regiments raised by the states for federal service were usually called volunteers or volunteer militia. - Most agree that the militia traces its origins to Massachusetts in 1636 when the "trained bands" of the towns, similar to the "trained bands" that formed the core of the New Model Army in England after 1645, were organized into regiments by the Massachusetts Bay Colony. Thereafter, and until 1903, the state militias were expected to provide the majority of nation's armed forces in times of national emergency.
___Thumbcruncher: The only thing you had right was that prior to 1903 the State militias were to supply the majority of the men in a national emergency. The first time the term National Guard was used was by Lafayette when he visited the United States in 1824. The title was from Lafayette's own Garde Nationale De Paris, and was accepted by a New York State Regiment of volunteers. Over the years before the Civil War the number of such units expanded until in 1878 the National Guard Association was formed. It was the NGA that pushed for the passage of a new militia Act that made them the only official active militia in the country: the Dick Act of 1903. - As for the Spanish American War, the States didn't raise any troops for that conflict. Modern Revisionists say the State of New York gave Roosevelt the chance to serve. Reality says he resigned his State militia commission and then volunteered for service in the conflict. Whole NGA units resigned and then marched down to recruiting stations because their state wouldn't allow them to serve. Some states protested by creating new militia units that were to replace the former units when they returned. The US government ordered these units disbanded after the war and that the former volunteers be reinstated. One New York governor went so far as to kick an organization called the National Rifle Association out of the State as a protest against the Spanish American War. Thats why the Creedmore Cup rifle marksmenship events are held in Nw Jersey in stead of Creedmore Long Island
___ek ErilaR: Read the orders of battle for the engagements in the Span-Am War. You will find state militia regiments in everyone of them. Mass and NY did the same as they did in the Civil War; they raised volunteer regiments for federal service built around cadre drawn from the state militia. The 2nd, 6th and 9th Mass. Volunteer Infantry and regiments from New York, North Carolina Ohio, Pennsylvania and Michigan were in Cuba and Puerto Rico. - The nick name name "national guard" adopted by one New York regiment for a single event means nothing. As you note, the regiment was an element of the long existing New York State Militia. "NYSM" was stamped on their belt buckles. - Are seriously saying that there were "NGA" units in any state before 1903? The National Guard Association was a lobbying group. This is an obscure point but some states still have active State Guards that are not a part of the National Guard. You are a bit over your head if you do not think that the National Guard itself traces its origins to the Mass Bay Colony in 1636. You have not done the basic reading.
___Thumbcruncher: The problem isn't that I haven't done the basic reading, the problem is I have gone beyond it. Basic reading says the 1792 militia Act was never taken into effect and it has no requirements. The facts are it was amended four times (the last in 1822) and it has a caliber clause requiring the male population to own a specific caliber of arm. - You mentioned that some States still have Active State Guards. Basic reading says thats illegal: a more extensive look uncovers the State Defense Force Acts passed after the first World War. There is your Cadre Strength militia, kept at Cadre strength by federal law until War is declare. Then, because the Federal government will only supply enough arms to equip a force half the strength of the NG units in the State, most states operating SDF units will only operate a force half the size of there peace time NG unit. And as of last report from the National Guard Bureau there are 24 States with active SDF units. - Do you deny the existence of the National Guard Association in 1878. And of course by default you deny the groups they represented, for what is a lobbying group for but to lobby Congress for a specific group of people. So if the lobbying group formally formed in 1878, by default there must have been groups of militia that called themselves National Guard. - In a different response to Mr. Kopel's posting you suggested that the Massachusetts system went unchanged from 1636 to 1903. Yet you then are unaware that in 1840 Massachusetts removed its laws governing its common militia and went only to a volunteer system. Its was this change that spread through New England and ended enforcement of the 1792 militia Act by 1850. - Basic reading: simply looking at the National Guard Website or talking to the NG rep. I have a copy of the poster they hand out showing this 1636 militia with their pikemen. The difference is understanding that your minuteman system was started just before the revolution, not back in 1636. It also lasted only a year into the Revolution as people began to realize that Minutemen never fought alone (other then at lexington). The rest of the militia always had time to form up before the British arrived. Oh, and the Minutemen were not volunteers: otherwise how do you insure that the youngest, strongest and most firearm experienced men are in it. And Massachusetts didn't financially support the minutemen with clothing and arms, drill money didn't begin until after the Civil War.
DICK ACT of 1902 . . . CAN'T BE REPEALED (GUN CONTROL FORBIDDEN) The Trump Card Enacted by the Congress Further Asserting the Second Amendment as Untouchable http://www.fourwinds10.net/siterun_data/government/us_constitution/gun_control/news.php?q=1237163642
Militia Act of 1903 The Militia Act of 1903 (32 Stat. 775), also known as the Dick Act, was legislation which codified the circumstances under which the National Guard could be federalized. It also provided federal funds to the National Guard to pay for equipment and training, including annual summer encampments. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Militia_Act_of_1903
Snopes.com Dick Act
The Dick Act passed in 1903 "invalidates all gun control laws" in the U.S.
Read more at http://www.snopes.com/politics/guns/dickact.asp#8XCesBZFZvAb7Qi4.99
FALSE
http://www.snopes.com/politics/guns/dickact.asp
DICK ACT of 1902 . . . CAN'T BE REPEALED (GUN CONTROL FORBIDDEN) The Trump Card Enacted by the Congress Further Asserting the Second Amendment as Untouchable http://www.webenews.com/dick_act_of_1902.htm
The NRA’s Trump Card: The Dick Act of 1902 http://www.1800politics.com/the-nras-trump-card-the-dick-act-of-1902/
GUN CONTROL, THE DICK ACT OF 1902, BILLS OF ATTAINDER AND EX POST FACTO LAWS http://www.newswithviews.com/Publius/huldah114.htm
Dick Act mythmaking http://armsandthelaw.com/archives/2013/01/dick_act_mythma.php
The Dick Act of 1902! Not a Joke http://beforeitsnews.com/alternative/2013/03/the-dick-act-of-1902-not-a-joke-2581386.html
The Daily Sheeple The Dick Act of 1902 http://www.thedailysheeple.com/the-dick-act-of-1902_042013